<Begin Segment 22>

BT: Okay. So, Frank, what are your recollections of leaving Heart Mountain and going to Tule Lake?

FS: Well, the only regret, and even today, I think about it very often. I just met a girl about two months before I was sent out, and her name was Barbara Tachibana. She's from Gilroy. And I found out through the museum, and this is kind of complicated, but she's a widow. And the person that told me said I should go see her. But I don't want to do that, you know. Fifty-some years, sixty years now, we're talking about. But anyway, she was such a nice lady, girl, and we were on a train, and I could still see her. I remember seeing her running along the side of the train waving. I'll never forget that. You know what I mean. Somebody running along a train and waving at me and saying, "Don't forget to write, don't forget to write." That was goodbye. I hate to leave that place. That was my only recollection of Heart Mountain.

BT: Did you stay in touch with her?

FS: No, because I knew my future, I was gonna go to Japan. I was already committed. So I think that's the reason why we got sent to Tule Lake.

BT: Well, it was clear that your parents had requested repatriation. And I guess it wasn't clear in the earlier part of the interview whether you had signed the "loyalty questionnaire"?

FS: I don't know. You know, it's very confusing because I don't even know when I turned in my citizenship paper. Because when I was in Tule Lake, I didn't know where the paper were.

BT: Oh, you mean the renunciation forms?

FS: No, the citizenship paper itself that you're supposed to turn in. I didn't even know where it was, I don't even know if I sent it in or not. And then the "loyalty question," is that one "no-yes"?

BT: Yes.

FS: I don't even remember signing that or answering that. 'Cause I got sent from here to there, remember, sent back to camp. And I think it was all in that one little period. So I really don't know what happened. I mean, maybe the... and the museum don't have my records. They only have it up to Santa Anita.

BT: So when your family was assigned housing at Tule Lake, do you remember what the block was like? Was it mostly...

FS: Block 16... no, Barrack... I think it was 69. Was that the block? 69? I think so. There was a number like that. 69 Block.

BT: And so where were most of those people from?

TI: Southern Cal mainly. There was a family from west L.A., Kawakami. Next door neighbor, Fujinami from central Cal, Minami's place. And gee, next barrack was, next block was Yamakido. Remember Yamakido? Charlie, Tad, Joe. No, Joe wasn't there.

BT: Is that how you knew the Yamakidos, or did you know them before.

FS: I knew Charlie before the war through judo. See, he used to be a Harbor City member, so we used to go tournaments, and I used to have to face him. He was a real stubborn man, judo.

BT: So at Tule Lake, then, the area that you were living in was mostly people who were segregated, right, to Tule Lake?

FS: All of 'em were segregated from different camps. Manzanar was way on that north side, one end.

BT: "Alaska."

FS: Yeah, yeah. They even had a billet, a separate place for 'em. One ward. That's how many people came. Actually, in that ward, most of the people that were sent from Hawaii to Manzanar, they were all intact when they came to Tule Lake. They were all hard-heads. They call them "ishiatama."

BT: And so how did you get along with a lot of the folks that were living in that block?

FS: We mind our own business. And like Kawakami, Tets, I met him through the camp and his sister, two sisters. The brother was more friendly, and the sister was kind of aloof. I'd say, "Hi," they look the other way. Typical Nisei; high nose. And then Yamakido's sister was too young, and then I know this guy Jim Kai, you ever heard of him? He had a sister, but I could never get into her head. I couldn't get friendly with her. She was a nice-looking lady, but I just couldn't, I don't know. And then who else was it? Most of the other people were Kibei. A man named Inouye, he was from Portland. And I met him because I was doing judo in camp, and he was one of my instructors.

BT: Oh, so which brings us to how did you occupy your time when you were in Tule Lake?

FS: I didn't work. Actually, there was no work.

BT: The newcomers.

FS: There was no work; there were too many people. And then there was always trouble going on in the coal crew, mess hall, Kibei bunch, you know what I mean, here and there. Oh, they had a killing. Do you remember that? The canteen manager got killed?

BT: Right.

<End Segment 22> - Copyright © 2009 Densho. All Rights Reserved.