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MA: And then after you were in school, then what did you do after you graduated?

NM: After I graduated from Iliff School of Theology, I went back to Japan with my hope that a church or a school might hire me with my master in education. But door after door was closed, because I was too Americanized. My thoughts are too dangerous. I was too opinionated.

MA: As a woman, I'm sure.

NM: Yeah, as a young woman. And they didn't want to have me. And they told me that if I was serious about working for a Japanese educational institution, I have to go to graduate school there in Japan. "So there's no place for you." That's the bottom line message I received. And, of course, there was no place in my family circle. So I was really in trouble. And I wrote one of my senior ministers when I took an internship. There were so many wonderful senior ministers, and I took an eight-month internship in Hawaii, Kailua United Methodist Church. And then Dr. Ken Haviland wrote me back, "If you really want to come back to the U.S.A., there is a place for you. But there's one condition. Condition is, study towards ordination to become a minister." And then, you know, those days, still in the '70s, right, I seldom see women ministers, even Caucasian women ministers were so rare. And you know, to be a Christian itself was so disgraceful for my father, and then myself becoming a minister? What a greater sin. What's more greater than that for my father? So I really resisted. But I had to survive, so I told Reverend Haviland, "Yes, I will pursue my education." And I was enrolled at Claremont School of Theology in California. Oh, it was hard, hard. Transition again, and academic expectation and the standard was very high. Yeah, so I had about thirteen black coffee, cups of coffee every day just to keep up with the classwork.

And then every time I received scholarship from people of Kailua United Methodist Church, I wrote a letter. And I asked Reverend Haviland, "I want to know who are these people who are giving me money, because I may not be able to graduate within two or three years. I'm a slow learner. So tell me who are giving me money." But Reverend Haviland said, "No question should be asked. I am going to deliver this letter to people, so don't worry." And then I graduated, and then I insisted, who these donors were. And Dr. Haviland told me, "It's not a group of people. It's only one person." And then I said, "That's unreasonable," you know. Because when I said "yes" to this scholarship, there was no cap. So that could mean hundreds and thousands of dollars, right? Until I graduate from this school, the money was guaranteed. So that's just too good to be true. But Dr. Haviland said, "Yes, that's the case." And then later I learned this was a Japanese American woman, second generation. She too wanted to pursue her higher education, but then Pearl Harbor happened and there was no school in Hawaii who was willing to admit her. She wanted to become a medical doctor, but no school. And her father told his daughter that, "Give up such a stupid dream. You are Japanese. This is a wartime. No school would like to have you. And being Japanese is a shameful thing, and then you, a woman, becoming a doctor? That's just improbable. So give up your dream or you will have nothing to do with me anymore." Doesn't this sound familiar? But this woman was just as hard-headed as I am, and she could not abandon her dream. She wrote the letter to other medical schools on the mainland, but no money, no scholarship, no school was willing to admit her. So she had to abandon her dream, and she became a successful realtor. And she made money, but she never was able to become a medical doctor. And I came along, Dr. Haviland mentioned my name, and she did not -- and even to this day -- she does not know me. But she wanted another woman to fulfill her dream, and she gave her money to me. So I was able to become a minister.

So, you know, Megan, my ministry is really my returning gratitude to those people who helped me to become who I am today. And when I came to this country, Bishop Wheatley and Mrs. Wheatley were so kind. And out of busy schedule they really took time to teach me what American culture was like, you know. And many, many fellow students took time to teach me English. So my life as a minister is really giving thanks to God, who gave me the blessing of all these kindnesses that came with these people.

MA: Wow, what a story, incredible story.

NM: I am grateful. And then this Margaret Date never allowed me to come to see her. And then she kept telling to Dr. Haviland, "No string is attached to this money. So, Nobuko doesn't have to come to see me." And that's what she told Dr. Haviland. It's almost like an unconditional love.

MA: And that money, you know, so you... at Claremont School of Theology you finished and you went on to, you were telling me, to Denver, is that correct? To the Simpson United Methodist in Denver.

NM: Uh-huh.

<End Segment 7> - Copyright ©2009 Densho. All Rights Reserved.