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TI: Okay, so let's go back to Renton, the farm. What other memories do you have growing up in Renton?

TO: Well, we didn't have a... we couldn't afford a truck or a car, and so finally I think things got a little better. He started, after he cleared the land, he was able to grow some vegetables and stuff. And meanwhile, on that piece of land, I think the Masuda family bought the lumber and rebuilt the house with my dad. Typical barn raising type of thing, he had an Issei friends from, different neighbors from the valley, I think, that helped him build this little house that we finally moved into and moved out of the neighbor's house that we were, as farm laborers, and we had our own house. And, of course, we didn't have any well at that time, so I remember Mom had to go to the neighbor's place and pump the water out. It was one of those hand pumps, pump the water out and carry it to the house to do the cooking.

TI: Go back to the building of the house, you called it like a barn-raising. I mean, so describe kind of how that all worked. I mean, so you had, sort of, neighbors from all over come, and these were all Japanese?

TO: Yes, Issei.

TI: And tell me, like about how many do you recall were there, and what kind of things were they doing?

TO: I think they were all farming. There was a guy named Yamashita, and I don't know, this must have been my father's friend. All I remember his nickname was Yankee. But he was kind of a carpenter type, so I think he was the one that did the supervising of building the house. Because, of course, I don't know if they, I'm sure they hadn't had any formal plans or anything, they just kind of cut and fit that, building a house. And I don't recall even how long it took to build that house. But I remember it wasn't too long, that they did get it built, but, of course, it was, by today's standards, just a shack. The boards, of course, in those days, all the sheathing on the outside of the house was what they called shiplap, it was green lumber, of course, it was dried out, and it'll open up and leave cracks. But they had tarpaper on the outside like the camp barracks. A very primitive house, of course, no indoor plumbing, it was a pit toilet, and we had no running water. We had no well on the property at that time, and we had no electricity. There was no electricity at that time at rural areas at all. It was shortly after that that the, after the house was built, that the electricity came up to the country. So everybody started having electricity, I distinctly remember that.

TI: Yeah, going back to the building, do you recall when the workers were done, was there food or drink or anything like that that happened?

TO: I assume there was. I don't recall that part of it. My dad liked to drink, so I assume there must have been some liquor. But I don't, for some reason I don't remember anything about that. I should, but I don't. I was there, I remember getting scraps of wood and playing with those scraps of wood. But I'm sorry to say I don't remember.

TI: Yeah, it's one of those things that I think over generations, we lose. I don't think the Sanseis or Yonseis would think so much about having lots of friends to build a house or something. It's something that's gotten lost over the generations. To think that the Isseis would just get together and build someone's house seems pretty amazing.

TO: One of the things I remember in those childhood days is making mochi with the neighbors. That was always a fun time. Of course, it was done in typical way, steaming it in a wood stove, you know how that's done, in the New Year's. My dad, for some reason, liked to cook, and so he had a lot to do with New Year's dinner. Of course, being, not having any neighbors, not too many neighbors, it wasn't a big, just our family and maybe the neighbors, because the neighbors, the Oyamas, Mrs. Oyama had passed away, so he had one son, so just the two of them, they'd come over and have a big feast that my dad would make. That was a big thing for him, so I distinctly remember that. Of course, in those days, we had no refrigeration or anything, so I don't really recall how this food was kept or anything like that.

TI: And so you were pretty far out. How frequently would you come into Seattle?

TO: Very, very infrequently. Very, very seldom. I think when I was a kid, I remember coming into Seattle on Fourth of July and riding in the back of the neighbor's truck, then we came into Seattle.

TI: And what would, so Fourth of July, I mean, what would be the reason to come?

TO: All I remember is we went to, I think it was... I think in Franklin High School there was Japanese baseball league, and I didn't play ball at the time. We went to ballgames there, watching. Then, of course, we ended up in Chinatown and had dinner and went home. And I think the parade, I think the Fourth of July parade was probably the reason we came in.

TI: And so when you'd come into Seattle, you'd see a lot more Japanese.

TO: Yes, definitely.

TI: How did you feel about that, when you saw that?

TO: I think I was kind of envious of how close they were. And I've kind of felt I was left out because they were all real close and they knew each other very well. And so that was my take at that time, I was kind of envious of them, of their situation.

TI: Let's go back in terms of your friends in Renton. Who did you play with?

TO: All hakujin kids. So I guess in some sense, growing up, and I didn't have some of the hangups some of the Nisei peers have because it was, I don't know, they were my buddies and I had no problems associating with hakujin at all. Only thing I distinctly remember when I was in grade school, as kids you play Cowboys & Indians. And for some reason, I was always picked as the Indian, and I was always on the losing side, of course. And that always, I think that kind of affected my complex or whatever, in being a minority. But that's the only thing I can distinctly remember because of my... after the war broke out, of course, that I was different than the others.

TI: Because you think you were always chosen to be the Indian because you, perhaps, were darker skin or...

TO: Exactly, and a little smaller in stature and all that.

TI: But other than that, do you recall any, being singled out for being Japanese or anything...

TO: I don't recall. I never had that feeling that I had any problems or they had any problems with me. I think at that time -- this was, of course, during the Great Depression -- and everybody was worried and everybody was struggling. Maybe in certain conditions people, white people were a little bit more discriminatory because the Japanese would work harder, work cheaper, but we never felt that out there. Because it seemed, I think everybody was in the same boat, we were all very, very poor.

<End Segment 8> - Copyright © 2009 Densho. All Rights Reserved.