<Begin Segment 8>

[Ed. note: This transcript has been edited by the narrator]

TI: So let's get to when you arrived in Idaho.

SA: Well, you know, I'm taking this from George Townsend's notes. He had wanted me to work with him on a book later, but as it (was), he suffered a stroke after I met him in Seattle, and so he left me his notes (...). And from that, he said he was the assistant project director in charge of (community services), activities and things. He wrote that he was a Quaker, and he was under (Dr. Milton S.) Eisenhower, (director of the WRA), who was the brother (...) of the general (Dwight Eisenhower). He said he was astounded to drive out (to Hunt, WRA Center), and I guess he had been down in California watching the other (WRA centers, the) Manzanar people. So he said he came out (to Minidoka and) this was the first time he saw us coming in by train and then by bus. But he was there when the buses were being (unloaded), and he said he just wept because he said, "What are we doing to these people?" I have his notes that maybe I can bring in, but he said it just tore at him, 'cause he knew this was wrong. But he said we looked confused and bewildered, and evidently the train steps were high and so some (soldiers and WRA officials) were out there in their cars, (they lifted) us down to the ground. And he is right because I remember that part. It was a far drop. And so with women and children, he said that it just (emotionally) tore him down (...). Frances Haglund wrote -- and she was a teacher in Minidoka, I kept up with her (...) when I went to Minnesota. I also visited her home in (Cannon Falls, Minnesota), en route to my rural nursing place. (...) She said (again) it was so wrong of us to have been put in camp. (Talking with her), I realized that these teachers (in Minidoka) were teaching off the cuff the first few days. They were teaching (with no lesson plans) because no one was ready. There (were) no blackboards, (...) no textbooks, (...) nothing. The major (portion) of the teachers had been recruited -- according to Townsend's notes -- from the Twin Falls, Idaho, STA group, this is the State Teachers Association. That's where we got our principal, and that's where we got the one who was (our) superintendent of the schools (Mr. Richard Pomeroy), which was interesting to me. And that was under George Townsend.

TI: So let's go back to George Townsend. Why do you think George Townsend took this job?

SA: Well, he said he wasn't prepared for it, but (...) I think he had sociology in (his) background. Plus the fact, I think (his) being a Quaker and (devoid of racial prejudice and) having worked with groups of people, I think that (...) he was the right person for that job, because his heart was with us. And so was (the project director, Harry Stafford, and) Eisenhower. They realized from the beginning that this was wrong, and they said they would do all they could (for us). (George Townsend had) Abe Hagiwara working under him, and we, Irene, (my girl friend) and I, were under Abe. And because he was coming into the (community) activities, (George Townsend was) the one that sent out the (orders for the) trucks and things to pick up (needed supplies), along with Reverend Andrews. He's the one who got the community church members together, different churches, to agree to let (the WRA) into the churches to pick up the choir gowns, (music sheets), and the hundreds of chairs that we were labeling, and the things we needed, (folding chairs), seventeen pianos (and books were) brought in (from the local Seattle Japanese churches).

TI: So let me see if I can summarize some of this. So Abe Hagiwara worked for George Townsend...

SA: Yes, he was one of the truck drivers.

TI: And this was while you were working with a community sort of...

SA: (Mr. George Townsend) was head of community activities, (Abe Hagiwara worked) under him because he was (one of the truck drivers).

TI: And so it was through this connection that he was able to work with the churches within the camps to get things like chairs and things for the community activities.

SA: Well, he was the only one able, actually, to order the transportation (needed) to go into Seattle and pick up all these things from the different churches.

TI: Oh, I see.

SA: 'Cause he had the agreement from (the) Methodist (church pastor), 'cause he had already met with them, and they agreed to let them have (whatever he needed, he received it), otherwise, we'd have nothing in our barracks. (In the) one barrack, we had occasionally a few movies come in (and) we tried to get (them) on a regular basis. That's the little (red) card I (have for entry into the "Wednesday movie time").

TI: I see. So let me make sure I understand this. So was this Abe Hagiwara or George Townsend that...

SA: George Townsend headed all the truck and transportation, and Abe was one of the (truck drivers) under him. But he was a great one because he (...) was from Alaska, and (...) a very uplifting, positive fellow. And as I said, (Abe's) the one (who also) directed people under him, which was us, and we were just numbering the chairs and where it came from, so we could return 'em. The same went for seventeen (pianos). I think at that time we had thirty-four to thirty-eight (blocks of barracks to supply, so a lot) had to be shipped (and assembled. "Two boxcar loads," according to Mr. Townsend's notes).

TI: And these were all coming from, primarily, the church?

SA: From the churches, (in the local Seattle areas).

TI: This is the first time I've heard this, this is interesting. So they actually sent trucks to Seattle.

SA: Oh, they had to (move and pick them up) because these are too heavy, and you know, how are we going to get them? (But they moved them according to Mr. Townsend in two boxcar loads to Minidoka. From his notes, I can't say for sure if it was our WRA trucks that moved it from the churches, but it was our Minidoka trucks that brought them to camp.)

TI: And they got chairs, pianos, things like that.

SA: We got chairs, choir gowns, (pianos and books).

TI: To bring back to, to Minidoka.

SA: To put into the blocks so we could use them. (The community activities, such as adult educational classes, craft group meetings, weddings, church services and social group meetings, movies, etc. needed the chairs, pianos, music books, etc.)

TI: Interesting. So we're jumping around a little bit, so we talked about first going to Minidoka, that's how we talked about George Townsend.

SA: Because he was there to meet the buses.

TI: Right, and sort of his reaction.

<End Segment 8> - Copyright © 2008 Densho. All Rights Reserved.