<Begin Segment 20>

TI: So during this period, when you're being confronted with all this information and the way you feel about this, were there any other people that you were talking with about this and asking questions?

EW: No, it was very difficult, especially in the army. There's so much, not only in the military, but even the current events of that time, to dissent or speak out against the policies of the administration was considered unpatriotic or disloyal.

TI: So even off the record, just trying to talk to someone would be viewed as, as not a good thing to do.

EW: Right. Even close friends I had, I didn't feel comfortable talking with them. And beyond that, maybe some casual friends among the officer corps, or even the enlisted corps, you don't know who, where people are coming from. And I'll give you an example; there are a lot of guys in the military who would be, are very personable. Beyond the political realm, they'd be great people to... and they really are great people. But when it comes down to personal beliefs and political opinions, people would just, they can turn on you in a heartbeat.

TI: Meaning that if they heard you dissenting or saying some things that, that were against the government, they would turn you in or something like that? Is that what you're saying? Or I'm not quite sure what you meant by that.

TI: Like there was this one enlisted guy, and he was a platoon sergeant, so senior enlisted, and he was very personable to me, he liked me a lot. But after I came out publicly, he gave me stares that were like daggers, like he just wanted to kill me. And I'll tell you, in the army back then or even now, it's okay to talk about how much you love the war and love the administration -- maybe not so much now -- but back then it was okay, fine, talk about how much you like. I mean, we don't really talk about politics in the military, or beliefs about the policy, but it's okay. But to talk about, if you were to say you were against the administration or against the war and you said that publicly or in front of other soldiers, you'd better watch your back. And I was walking up through the, through the barracks one day, and on the door of the platoon sergeant, one of these platoon sergeants and the platoon leader, the officer, was a poster and it said, "Get out of the way, all you F-ing liberals. We'll protect the country," something like that. Kind of implying that liberals and people who think that way don't have a right or can't protect the country because of their beliefs, and that only conservatives and people who are on the right wing spectrum, political spectrum, are those qualified to protect this country. And I had a problem with that. I told, I told the commanding officer and the first sergeant, because they had a problem with me. I brought it up really quietly to the platoon leader, and I said, "You know, I just would really appreciate that, if you'd take that down. I find that offensive, and I think you're sending a bad impression to other soldiers." And it really, it turned around on me, where the first sergeant was saying, why did have I have a problem with that, why was I talking with his platoon sergeant, which I wasn't, I was going through the proper channels. And I told him straight up, that I said, "This is the same thing as discriminating against people of race or religion or nationality. What you're saying is people of a certain belief or ideals are not allowed or not qualified to be able to protect this country and they should be thus discriminated against, or ostracized or hated." I said, "That's not what we should be teaching our soldiers."

TI: And so in this case, what happened, what did the CO or the other superiors do in this situation? Did they, did they make them take that sign down?

EW: I don't know, and I didn't even go back up there to check. I know that the commanding officer, he didn't even want to get involved. I was primarily talking about the first sergeant. And I got very angry. I said, I was just about to say, "Officers should be talking with officers." And I said, "If the CO has a problem, then he can talk to me." That first sergeant and I did not get along very well. [Laughs]

TI: But your sense is that if you're, if you're, have a particular perspective, that's okay to do things like this, but if you deviate from that, then you're, you're ostracized or you're...

EW: Yeah. If you do something that's unpopular, if you go against the unpopular decision or policies, which in the army, it's okay to be, to go along with the war, but it's not okay to be against it.

<End Segment 20> - Copyright © 2006 Densho. All Rights Reserved.