<Begin Segment 15>

TI: Okay, so when you go to Japan, what did it seem like, what was your impression?

MH: Well, it was strange, but it was kind of a good feeling to see people all look alike, all looked like me. It's a comfortable feeling, and just as it is a comfortable feeling in Hawaii where you're not the minority. And Japan was very interesting to me, because they had their culture, and as well as the American culture; they had symphonies, they had music things, so I enjoyed it. I met some interesting people there, and there were quite a number of Niseis by that time in Japan, because they couldn't get jobs here, they went to Japan. And a lot of the boys from the college went to Japan.

TI: So how did you find out about other Niseis while you were in Japan?

MH: Oh, I know. I worked for a... Tokyo Times, I think, I guess they called it. Welly Shibata of Seattle -- this is way back -- he and Miyagawa, I think, went there and they were running this English newspaper. So I applied there and got a job writing, but I hated journalism because I don't like... what is it? You have to have a story in by a certain time, that stress. Just hate that. So I said, "No thanks," and I quit that job. But through that, I met people. And then some of my Nisei friends came over, and through them, we got an apartment, we lived there, we had a lot of fun, and we went through what you call bokuu enshuu they call it, and that's whenever you hear the bomb raid, the sirens ringing, we have to close the shades and just stay in the house. That was kind of exciting.

TI: So what city were you living in?

MH: Huh?

TI: What city was this?

MH: Higashi, Nakano, outside of Tokyo.

TI: And the bombers were who? I mean, who would be...

MH: Well, it's a, "enshuu" is "practice."

TI: I see, so these were just air-raid drills.

MH: Yeah, drills. But each time -- and they did it a lot. And I'm sure Japan was prepared for, preparing for war as well as the United States, because beginning of 1941? Is that when the war was? I got a letter from the American embassy saying, "We cannot be, we cannot be responsible for you if you do not leave Japan by..." and I think they gave me a couple months, "by May." I think it was May. So if they didn't anticipate war, they couldn't have sent that.

TI: So all U.S. citizens got, got this warning in 1941, early 1941, to essentially leave Japan by May of 1941? 'Cause tensions were, were increasing.

MH: And I think I got the next-to-the-last ship that came back to the United States from Japan.

TI: Now, when you got that, did you sense that there was going to be war between the U.S. and Japan?

MH: Well, as I tell you, I was so naive, but I knew something was wrong, and I was naive enough to have worked in a place that sounded so good. It was called Kokusai Bunka Shinkokai, which later I found means that it's a cultural, a cultural institution. So they had architects and photographers, and different people. Very interesting place to work, but these people were connected with the military, and they were preparing for occupation. The architects were ready to come in and build houses in Arlington -- [laughs] -- I mean, they were preparing all for war. And a lot of the, the navy men used to come, and I used to think, "Gee, what is this?" Stupid me, I didn't know anything. And so when war... when I was leaving Japan, these men got together around a big table, and they tried to convince me that I should stay. That if war should come, "We're going to win, and you are going to be our educational director, and you're gonna go in there and you're gonna establish the education system in America, and then Kawazoe-san will go and to the, build the houses, and Haar would go in and do the photography."

TI: Well, this is, this is fascinating. So this group believed that Japan would eventually go to war, they would win, and that there would be this large effort to, to, I guess, occupy the space.

MH: Right.

TI: And they tried to convince you to join them.

MH: Right.

TI: So what did you think? What did you say?

MH: I thought, "No, America is my country, and if you're going to come over and do that, you've got to do it yourself. I'm not gonna help you." But these were very, men up, up in the government, and here I'm talking so sassy to them. But I said, "No, no, no, I'm not." So then they piled a lot of literature for me to bring back. Well, I couldn't read, so I didn't know what I was bringing back. And my parents read it and they said, "Oh, it's dangerous having this stuff in the house," and they threw it all into the furnace and burned it up very shortly after I came back to America.

TI: And did your parents tell you what, what was contained in it? What kind of information?

MH: You know, all these horrible things about America, and how Americans, America is what they're doing to Japan and how eventually they're gonna strike. All that kind of stuff must have been in it, because my parents were terrified, and they said, "Who gave you this?" And I said, "People in Japan." And even my uncle, I went to see him at our country home, says, said to me in Japanese, "Stupid." I said, "I'm going back to America." He said, "No, no, no, you stay here. He says, "If war comes, they're gonna, it's gonna be bad for you." I said, "But I want to be with my parents." He wouldn't listen, and so when I left the house, he said, "A stupid fool like you deserves to go home." And this is my uncle, my father's brother. So I left very sad, and then I went further down to Nagasaki to visit my, my aunt, and then on the way home, they notified them for me to look up the hill. There he was, waving a white handkerchief, and I could see him from the train, he and his wife. This is Uncle, waving a white handkerchief. It was very touching.

TI: And what, what did the white handkerchief mean to you?

MH: It meant, "I love you," or "don't take what I said to heart," or whatever, "forgive me," or whatever. And I thought, "Oh, gee, poor thing." He was so sure that Japan was gonna win.

TI: Was that the last time you saw him?

MH: Huh?

TI: Did you see him anytime after that, or was that the last time you saw him?

MH: No, last time. I never saw him again, or his wife. Never. But that's what war does. I have a cousin who fought for the Japanese war, he's now dead but he lost his leg and so foolish.

<End Segment 15> - Copyright © 2004 Densho. All Rights Reserved.