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AI: So that gives a flavor for the times, the era here in Seattle, and, and some of the attitudes that, about race at the time. 'Cause I also wanted to ask about something, about other things that were going on when you and Ralph were here in the late '40s and early '50s, and one was that, just on the national scene, Senator Joe McCarthy was becoming very prominent with the anti-Communism.

EH: Well, he, he was... '48, '50, '48-'49, in '49, when Ralph was still in journalism, his assignments were constantly anti-Communist, called red-baiting, and it was patterned right after Joe McCarthy, and 'course, the university had fired three professors, prominent professors, I don't know whether they actually were Communists. Mike James, who was with channel 5? Anyway, he and his sister, a prominent psychologist, writes for the Times, anyway, their father apparently got, was one of those fired. But Ralph just got sick of the red-baiting assignments, and said -- well, and this was after we were married, so this was '50... '50. And he said, "If I get another red-baiting assignment, I'm leaving. I'm taking a leave." And I said, "You know, you've been saying this all year, tomorrow's not going to be any different." But sure enough, the next day he came home and said, "Well, I left." And fortunately, when he first came to Seattle, he, it was summertime, and I guess he was able to get a job at the post office. Post office was a saving grace for a lot of blacks, that was the one civil service job they could land. And he worked at the post office for, I think, part of the summer until school started, but two or three times during the Christmas rush he was able to get mail carrier jobs, and anyway, this, when he left the university, I mean, took a leave from the university, he went to work for Boeing and two or three months after that, he said, "No, I'm not going to do this for the rest of my life."

And he came back to the university and changed his major to political science, and got his degree in political science. And then, then went on, wanted to get his master's degree in political science, but wanted to do a thesis on the new Indian government, because he had, he was stationed in India for three years, segregated army. But in the army, he was in the -- well, there was a black Army Corps of Engineers, and I, I don't think he was part of that Corps of Engineers, but he was on the typing pool, he was in, in the office, because he could type. And he had to do things like order all kinds of supplies, trucks, and that kind of thing, and, but Nehru was becoming a very popular, respected, and they were expected, they were excited about getting their independence, because Britain had promised them that, if they had, if they would help in the war effort. And Gandhi was also prominent. And so it was (going to) be an exciting era to write about. And anyway, they got their, they got their independence, but when Ralph wanted to write his master's degree on India, there wasn't anybody on campus that was interested in India. But he wouldn't give up, and he kept going around and around, he couldn't find an advisor in any department. And finally, in political science, there was a woman who was heading, she was specializing in British affairs, and so she said, "Okay, if it's okay with everybody, we'll put him in the British department, and I'll be his advisor." And so that's, he did his master's degree on India. There was a, there was a Professor Martin, who was a political science professor, and he had gotten an assignment to India, maybe five years after the war, and so he, he came back when Ralph was still doing his master's degree, and he said, "Where's that young man that wants to do his master's degree on India?" And he wanted, he was, he was eager to get this supplemental help, but Ralph wasn't going to change his plans. He was well into his thesis, and he couldn't afford to start over again, and he wasn't willing to, so he didn't pick that up. But anyway...

<End Segment 2> - Copyright © 2004 Densho. All Rights Reserved.