<Begin Segment 19>

TI: Well, I want to back up a little bit. So you went to the University of Washington for three years, so you just needed to finish your dissertation? Was that the last step?

RM: Yeah, yeah.

TI: Okay, and this was about 1954.

RM: Right. I went, and, but I had worked part-time from '51 to '54, when it was here, for a company called Harper McGee, in electronics, and I memorized parts numbers for television and radio. And so when the people come in for those, I would just go get them, I didn't have to look up the schematic. And they were wonderful people, they were the RCA distributor, and it was the early days of television. And it was a good job, almost thought seriously of not going back into education. There was lots of money, there was, it was a good group to work with, there was a future there if I wanted it. But I didn't like the work. I wasn't getting, I couldn't, I wanted to be with people who wanted to learn, and I knew that, and so the job chance came in at Renton, so I went there.

TI: I'm curious, 1954, I mean, that was fifty years ago, and, and I'm thinking it's also the fifty-year anniversary of (Brown v. Board of Education).

RM: Yes, yes.

TI: And I was wondering, did that have any impact during that period of time in Renton?

RM: Yes. One of the very -- two things happened that were extremely important in 1954 in Renton. There was a discussion amongst the faculty, if a "Negro" -- as it was at that time -- applied to teach in the Renton school districts, "would you be in favor or opposed?" It was plebiscite amongst the teachers, Stan Thompson. And I, I think there was only one vote against hiring a Negro. And right away, in my teaching at Renton, I first had a Japanese, Ikeda, Roy Ikeda, fine fellow who wanted to practice teach. And they were worried about minorities coming into the teaching profession. And so I worked with Roy, and he was fine, great teacher. And then we had, I had a black fellow named Charlie Jackson or something. Very, another fine teacher. And then, then I had a Jewish girl come, she was very shy, in Renton that would chew you up, you know, if you were shy, but she got along okay. So they were coming into the profession in 1954, '55, '56, that era, and when blacks did apply in the school district, they came in without any problems. But there were, these were the pioneers.

TI: Well, do you think the Brown decision made, made a difference in Renton?

RM: Yeah. I remember discussing, the Brown decision was why Mr. Thompson had the plebiscite amongst the teachers. It was framed around this kind of a concept: should we wait for a generation, should we wait for another generation before they, allowing them to come in to the profession? Is it time now to change the teaching profession? Is it, should we have this? A lot of people in the discussion said, "No, we should wait the twenty-five years and then put in the process."

TI: Was Renton, do you think, sort of at the, a leader in this area, or how would you characterize the Renton school district with the other school districts?

RM: It depended on the area. In the social studies we had, Carl Johnson was the department chair, and he was, I like to use the term "open-minded." Fine man, just wonderful, tremendous teacher. Great, great ability in the classroom to motivate people. And his ideas on, on this were adamant: "They are ready now, we need to have different points of view in this school." And he stood for that all the way through. And, and I think bucked the problem. At the, this was also happening in Tacoma at the same time. And, and I know that Jack Tanner went to the school board in 1954, after the Brown decision, and asked that black teachers be allowed in the school district. Not one word in all of the minutes of the Tacoma school district ever spoke to this issue. Nor in Renton, until Stan Thompson brought it up. It was extremely important to Stan.

And I liked him; I had great respect for him, not only because he stood up for me, but because he wasn't afraid to bring the issue out and lay it on the table. You know, most people would just shovel it underneath. He wanted to address this, he wanted to have... and he asked for minority teaching candidates. So we went in that, in that frame of mine. And I didn't talk to him but quite rarely. And, but it was really interesting, I think his great motto, "Don't bother me with little issues, and don't leave me out of the big ones." And that was the way he operated. He had a faculty of a hundred, and so I, I worked with him, I liked his style, I liked his approach to students. We were... and when I was president of the teachers, I, there was no administrative teacher classification consciousness here, no struggle with him over this issue, or any issue as far as I can remember.

<End Segment 19> - Copyright © 2004 Densho. All Rights Reserved.