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AI: So you were just telling us about the, how you began the development of your principles or what you sometimes call Ike's Principles?

TI: Yes.

AI: And I'm wondering if you would tell us a little bit more about that in relationship to your work?

TI: Yes. Well, I am consciously functioning with certain ideas in mind. And the more I thought about that, experiences, it helped crystallize the development of the principle. For instance, the second principle on gaman, "keep on trucking." One example will show that the regional office at that time of Health Education and Welfare called me up, and said, "Ike, I know you're interested in research, so why don't you submit a proposal to develop the first Asian American mental health research center?" So I said, "Great." "You've got one month." One month. So I knew from day one that it was going to be difficult, that there would be a lot of no-nos, and discouraging points of view. I got a call from my friend in Los Angeles. And (he told me), "I hear you're thinking about putting in a proposal." And essentially he says, "Bug off. We already got a proposal in." And I told him that if his proposal was the best in the nation, then nation is blessed and the Japanese community would be blessed. And if by chance what we're drafting is the best, then the Japanese community would be benefiting. I brought together about a dozen (Asian) American researchers from the UW to the center. And after couple of hours of discussion, they told me, "We can't participate because this is not a university-controlled study. It's community-based. So, sorry." There went the heart of the research. Without researchers -- [laughs] -- it just wouldn't work. But I had this gaman attitude of bearing with, irregardless. And so fortunately, I had that three-year state planning methodology that we developed. I was quickly able to re-formulate it, as it relates to this proposed research center.

And then I thought the $250,000 budget spread over the United States was, would be too diluted. So our proposal draft was within Northwest region. You get more bang for the buck that way by concentrating your efforts. Well, the National Institute of Mental Health, (said) they were interested in what we were proposing, so they came, did a site visit. I had brought together some Japanese American students (from the) School of Social Work, and then I had one person who happened to be a researcher/nursing specialist. And so with that, I devised this proposal. It was about forty pages within two weeks. Well, then I called these researchers back again and say, "Here's our plan. What do you think? Come on. Let's, come on in." One of the major reasons why we didn't want the university control is that they get those indirect costs. About 40 percent of the budget would be overhead to the university, and only 60 percent would be to the community. We wanted complete community control. They were somewhat surprised that I had come up with a plan within the short time. And they agreed to come in. They had all been working on many proposals. And so before I knew it, I had a thick proposal. I had all the resume, which was extensive, plus they had many (more) proposals.

When the site (visitor) came and reviewed our proposal, they were impressed, but said, "There's one little problem. It's for the Northwest, and this has to be a national project." And they said, "Tomorrow morning at 7:00 a.m. at Sea-Tac Airport, we're leaving. So if you want to revise it, you're welcome because we like what you propose." So the only person available was this nurse/researcher. The two of us said, "Okay. Let's get back together at 7 o'clock p.m. -- it was 4:30 we (completed rewriting the proposal). (We) completely redid the (proposal) in five or six hours. This gaman attitude really kept us focused on getting the thing written. And in our estimation it was a better proposal. I got a copy of the Los Angeles proposal, which was university-connected.

AI: Now, excuse me. I know that you started off using this as an example of the gaman principle...

TI: Yeah.

AI: ...but I also want to know what is the end of the story? What happened? Was the proposal funded, and did you end up starting an Asian American research center?

TI: Well, what happened is we didn't get the proposal. But I felt, internally I felt good that we did complete (the) proposal in a ridiculously short time. And found out this other proposal was a very poor proposal than mine, but they had very good connections. And so they were approved. San Diego State University was university-connected relationship. The principal investigator of the research center had problems with San Diego State, so they terminated that contract. They took a year or two before they were able to find (the) University of Chicago to undertake as a fiscal agent. Progress really got delayed. So the assumption I had taken, community-based control and the methodology we laid out as our plan, for a variety of reasons wasn't accepted. But I felt good that we had tried. I had series of other experiences like, similar to that. It really reinforced that gaman principle of determination, not be deterred by no time, no money, not enough people to help you. You could use all kinds of excuse. So we just learned how to not be discouraged. And this attitude really helped me with many other project experiences.

And it just, pick another example, ikebana, as I mentioned earlier -- although I'm not a flower grower and that sort of thing. What I've read is that it does take only a few flowers resource and, if they're arranged in a certain disciplined way, it can be very powerful versus maybe even more powerful than a dozen roses and have a lot of resources. So instead of having a bouquet mentality, I thought of this ikebana mentality, that having the agency, Atlantic Street Center being small and poor, I felt (if) we concentrate that energy we can do something powerful. And we ended up doing that. So it's ended up opening more doors and being involved in, on a national level to develop juvenile justice, standard goals for juvenile and delinquency prevention. And we wrote a 800-page document. We had national authorities come in on different aspects like courts, correctional system, educational system, community-based system to come out with this report. But of course, good old American style is that we don't do more than plan. We don't follow through. But anyway, just the power I thought I had with what I had, that I didn't need to have more money, more staff, opened many, many doors. And so that developed into this ikebana mentality, the principle.

So that's how these eleven principles developed through my own great experiences I had, struggles I had and beginning to formulate that -- there's something to what I have been taught early in life -- that the Japanese culture was positive and can be very powerful, rather than have a former attitude I had, "Well, everyone else sees me as a 'Jap,' and therefore, I was a 'Jap.'" No longer accepting that. (At the) same time feeling proud of the (Japanese) heritage I was taught and formed over the years (was) very powerful. Having this positive attitude towards your own culture has strengthened me, too. So this is why I came up with this Ike's Principles, trying to empower other people as well. Because it comes down to our attitude -- all of my principles -- change your attitude towards what you're doing, you can do a whole lot. It's been a great experience working out these principles and continue trying to refine them.

AI: Thank you for explaining that.

TI: Yes.

<End Segment 10> - Copyright © 2000 Densho. All Rights Reserved.